Re: Welding Table

I start to work on the top frame again. Added support to allow proper mounting of legs with these on line with the casters' center of gravity.

At this point and with the few hours weld time under my belt I still don't trust distortion thus the use of additional clamps. Probably more than needed. I read some subjects about metal distortion. The theories are ok but practical results vary a lot and this due to a lot of parameters involved. Variable parameters ... LOL.

However as I earn more weld time I am confident that sooner or later I will have to make metal distortion start working to my advantage. Easier said than done but can be done.

Here's the frame on the table top as it is without any restrictions.

notice the gap ... this is a result of the center bow of the table top.

if I balance the frame on the center this gap will be smaller because the other half will go to the other side

A lot of suggestions coming in how to tackle the problem. Some say to just fasten the center to the frame beam using countersink bolts. Possible. A deep reach clamp with enough force to bring the center itself to the frame for welding is another solution. Custom clamp fab for this purpose can also be made.

The thing I want is very simple. I just want the table top to allow me to lay down tubes , angles bars on top and have the miter cuts fall into place. With the bow this can be done but will need shimming and it defeats the purpose of the build.

Let's see what happens.

Re: Welding Table

My stock was short and barely made it .... if you have gaps like this you can use an extra wire to fill it up when mig welding ... just dip the wire in and out in the weld puddle

Legs mounting taken cared of ... I'll worry about gussets later ... i know the leg might not hold by itself even if full welded. The top alone now weights around 140-150 kg ... maybe changing the legs to 3" square tubes is even better

I continue to beef up the top frame ... the objective is to be able for it to contain the top bow spring back when its welded or bolted to it ....

I hope I can have a workable welding table soon. I would want to move my work forward near the shutter gate where I don't have to do much clean up after each Wip session. It's the grinding dust I want to manage better.

Re: Welding Table

Moji .... this is what I mean when I say I can put a countersink bolt on the center of the table top to pull the bow down to the frame ... at least I don't have to fab a deep reach clamping solution if I go with the bolt .... maybe even take it a step up and just bolt the whole table to the frame instead of welding it .

( pic borrowed from weldingweb.com )

If I do I would prefer torx or allen head bolts.

Re: Welding Table

Moji .... this is what I mean when I say I can put a countersink bolt on the center of the table top to pull the bow down to the frame ... at least I don't have to fab a deep reach clamping solution if I go with the bolt .... maybe even take it a step up and just bolt the whole table to the frame instead of welding it .

( pic borrowed from weldingweb.com )

If I do I would prefer torx or allen head bolts.

Just do it... ala nike:thud:

Re: Welding Table

seriously Jay, you have the knowledge and the means to achieve what you want or need. You just have to trust your instincts, afterall we all look up to you when it comes to metalworking. Show us what you got....:tumbleweed:

Re: Welding Table

seriously Jay, you have the knowledge and the means to achieve what you want or need. You just have to trust your instincts, afterall we all look up to you when it comes to metalworking. Show us what you got....:tumbleweed:

LOL ..... yes more heads better than one. Thanks Timb.

Re: Welding Table

LOL ..... yes more heads better than one. Thanks Timb.

now back to work.........:whipass:

Re: Welding Table

I prepare to full weld the added supports

This is my first attempt to make distortion work for me. I eased up selected strategic clamping positions when welding the flip side. Likewise I also increased the heat at pre determined weld points.

Here I got what I wanted. I gave the frame a slight concave center bow.

My thinking is that a slightly concave frame and a convex plate on top of each other will give a better chance that the plate will be pulled flat when clamped together.

Metal dust . this is the first sweep of the floor ... a second one will yield some more.

the chips on the plastic lid are from the dry cut saw.

This is my problem why I want the Wip area to be transferred near an open gate.

When grinding I can position so that the sparks are directed outside the gate. Probably add a blower too to help fan the dust to go outside. This is where a 4 swiveled caster welding table setup helps ... I can always rotate it so that my grinding sparks always point outside.

Re: Welding Table

There are 2 ways to mount the top now:

1. Convex Plate to Concave frame on top.

Here I tested this configuration

Frame is clamped the other side already up to center

clamped

frame looks like it's holding up now ... the plate moved up ... prior to the reinforcements the frame moved down .... LOL

Checked the table for flatness using a longer square tube ... better than before ... the edges are fine now and no more see saw

I'll have to flip it up but it's heavy and can't do it alone ... tomorrow, I need to check the top itself.

The other way is

2. Concave Plate to convex frame on top ... will test it as well then choose which one gives a better surface flatness

Thinking to beef up the center support some more ... clamping is one thing ... welding heat is another ( mas malupit ) when plate is welded to the frame

Re: Welding Table

brader, no offense... hiramin mo muna ang straightedge ni moji kung pwede since you are aiming for flatness to a very high degree (Moji I know will agree, just feed him or give him a good discount on his next acquisition sa yo :agree:). I wouldn't even trust my starrett(dahil short lang) let alone a square tube to give a correct reading. :tv_horror:
If it were me I would put the high point in the middle and pull using screws from there, I probably wouldn't weld it fixed. but then again you are not me :mellow: and that isn't mine.
I know another solution... get a 1" thick flat metal sheet and don't use that anymore, pangit na yan, kunin ko na lang sa yo ng mura dahil hindi naman flat....:tomato:

Re: Welding Table

LOL .... I think it will be good enough. The pieces I will be working on it will be square tubes, angle and flat bars only. If I flip it up tomorrow and lay down some tubes and the miters align then I'm set. Unlike in woodworking it's difficult to get high precision in this type of metal working. In woodworking stocks can be squared in the jointer, thicknesser or even plane it.

If the plate was flat then I could have saved 830 pesos. The cost of the added reinforcements not to mention wire, gas and electricity. It was not in the budget but what to do ...

Hmmmm let me think the bolts option again .... will have more control using this fastening strategy as pressure can be adjusted.

can lay 3" x 1/4" thick flat bar around the top of the frame ... then tap holes for fastening bolts ... clamp it before bolting so as not to wreck the tap threads

maybe can even rent a mag drill somewhere if it's not that expensive

Re: Welding Table

ok if you say so... but you do know how metal (square bars too) are handled after they are made, right? they get thrown around, bashed, carried in wrong places and mishandled. So they probably are out of square in the hundreds of inch (not thousands), but like you said you will be working with flat bars and tubes on them so you don't have to worry...
wait, why again do you want your table top to be flat?:confused:
btw, are you even sure the reinforcement is flat?

wood on the other hand doesn't need to be in the thousandths accurate, they work fine even in tenths of an inch since they move with the weather/climate/temperature/ humidity...

Re: Welding Table

I'm not much concerned about the reinforcements .... my objective is the flat top. It I achieve this then it will be ok. Thinking that if bolts are used then I could even shim if needed.

If I weld naman it should be low heat and controlled. Doable using gas welding but still will not be easy to fully contain distortion. Bolts will eliminate the distortion variable.

Re: Welding Table

I'm not much concerned about the reinforcements .... my objective is the flat top. It I achieve this then it will be ok. Thinking that if bolts are used then I could even shim if needed.

If I weld naman it should be low heat and controlled. Doable using gas welding but still will not be easy to fully contain distortion. Bolts will eliminate the distortion variable.

also good if you need to repair it in the future... mapractice mo na norsemen mo dyan :matrix:

Re: Welding Table

it puts to much strain on my peabrain whats going to be jay's projects after this welding table wip.

my imagination is going crazy.

:marriage: