Re: Outdoor Stairs

First of all what is the height of the top of your roof deck, will the metal staircase going up your roof deck be located inside a living area or from the external side of the house.

As you said this will be your next project being a woodworker, may I ask who will be doing the cutting and measurements, fabrications, installation etc etc. Do you have the necessary equipment, tools and welding machines that will be used in fabricating your next project. I do not know how simple or intricate you have in mind the stairs you are thinking or planning to accomplish but it will be a lot of work for a first timer in metal working. Hope you don't mind me asking but have you had experiences before in cutting and welding metals. If you don't have the needed tools, and you have no idea how to cut and weld, then I guess you better be in touch with a welder/fabricator contractor to help you out in your next project.

Well you can use 2 pcs of tubulars, 2 x 4s welded together to get a 2 x 8, strong enough to support your steps/threads of angle bars 1 1/2" x 1 1/2" x 3/16" thick. The angle bars can be welded into a rectangular shape of perhaps 12" x 24" or 36", depends on the width you are planning, then welded on your main support. The length of your 2 x 8 main support will depend on the height of your present roof deck plus as well as your design.

https://www.google.com.ph/search?q=metal+stairs+design&espv=210&es_sm=122&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=GeKvUq3NKcKWrgfap4GADA&ved=0CD0QsAQ&biw=1366&bih=666

CHEERS and wish you GOOD LUCK !! 😉

Re: Outdoor Stairs

Oh so sorry bro, its my mistake asking you where will the metal stairs be located, so it is going to be outside, based from your title thread, well using steel for your stairs will also need a lot of preparation after it is installed, meaning you will have to have it well painted so it will not rust easily. Perhaps several coats of metal epoxy then several coats too of your final colored finish.

Again good luck ! 😉

Re: Outdoor Stairs

Hi Rosy. Thanks for the insights and the idea on the words to be searched. I think its starting to get clear now.

As to tools, I bought a yamato welding machine when we fabricated the gate. I already have some basic welding skills and I just asked my dad to guide me as he had attended those welding classes in our area. We used round tubes for our gate and covered it with concrete board planks so it was really a simple project. We used an angle grinder to cut the tubes.

Now, since this is my second metalworking project, this is a perfect justification to buy a metal cutoff saw. 🙂 I already read the Bosch thread by @JayL and will probably get the GCO 2000 if the price is reasonable here. (I am from Cebu).

As to the project:
1. The height of deck from the ground is only 5 feet as our house is on a sloping lot. The rear portion of the lot is higher.

2. The width of the stair will be 2 feet. The right side is attached to the house. The top portion will be a landing 2ft x 2ft. It will only have 7 or 8 steps. It will look similar to this:

3. I initially thought of using angle bars as the stringer (like a truss design) but it will involve a lot of cuts and weldings. I didnt know there was a 2x4 steel tubing. 🙂

4. So with your suggestion, I will weld together the 2x4s and use it as the stringer. Then make a rectangular step and just weld to the stringer, like this?

5. And lastly, is there a thickness specification of the 2x4 tubulars?

Yes, it will be exposed to the elements, so it will be painted with anti rust and epoxy.

Thanks. 🙂

Re: Outdoor Stairs

I am not really fund of using tubulars, why? well they rust easily and their walls are thin, usually 1.5 mm or 2.0 mm thick. I suggested it only coz in my mind the stairs will be constructed from the inside, so not much of a rusting problem. Since the project will be located outside, may I suggest using C channels, walls of this material are very much thicker than the tubulars that I have mentioned. Again you may opt to get 2pcs of 2" x 4", then welded together to get a 2" x 8" wide support or stringer. Or you can also decide to this option on getting a 1 pc. 2" x 4" and a pc of 2" x 6", weld them together to get a much wider stringer of 2" x 10", just perfect for your steps of 1 foot x 2 feet.

I am really glad to know that you have already some basics in welding and you can too ask your father for some assistance or help during the fabrication process and that you also have some of the tools needed for its completion. Well for cutting metals specially the angle bars, you will really need a heavy duty metal cut off machine, this tool will easily help you a lot during repeated metal cuttings. There are good brands of this cut off saw machines, like Bosch, Makita, DeWalt, Maktek or Milwaukee or Skil, it will just depend on your choice and budget.

Since you already have a sort of a pattern or idea of what you want to achieve, then it will not really be that hard on starting that project, so GO GO GO and start canvasing the materials you will need and use.

Again, GOOD LUCK and stay SAFE during cutting and welding !! :agree::thumbup:

Almost forgot, for your steps, if you can afford to buy a half sheet of those corrugated stainless steel plates of gauge 16 or 14, you can cut them up to fit your steps, spot weld them to your angle bar steps to complete the whole new project.

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Re: Outdoor Stairs

Thanks rosy. Its clearer now. Yes, I will be looking for that corrugated metal sheet for the steps. Initially, I was thinking of using the steel matting I have lying around as the steps (with appropriate supports) but I have 5 small dogs so the holes would be dangerous for them. I just hope theyre not as expensive.

I read the thread on chop saws and visited tool shops this morning here in Cebu. Choices are:
Makita 2414NB - Php 8,400 (2,000 watts)
Metabo CS 23-355 - Php 8,850 (2,300 watts)
Bosch GCO 2000 - Php 9,500 (2,000 watts) - I dont know why its that expensive here, compared to around 8k in Manila
Bosch GCO 2400 - Php 10,500 (2,400 watts)
AEG SMT 355 - Php 7,900 with free grinder - (though I already have an angle grinder)

The store (Belmont) is a little partial about Metabo since its the most high end daw though after reading some posts here, this is already made/assembled in China (not that it matters though but its good to have some bragging rights on the made in Germany thing lol). Im a little partial to Makita since my miter saw, circular saw, drills, jigsaw and grinder are all Makita.

What do you think? Would metabo be the best buy?

Re: Outdoor Stairs

Hey koykoy, if you are more partial with the Makita brand, then by all means get that Makita, I just hope the cutting disc is included. But still decisions will still be yours, either of the brands you mentioned are good and will do the intended job, you can choose any of them, which ever amount you are willing to pay/spend for a chop saw machine.

So good luck with your choice ! 😉 😎

Re: Outdoor Stairs

I called up the Bosch showroom this morning and the sales rep is kind enough to tell me that they are having a 20% inventory sale starting tomorrow. So that just makes the decision easier. (Although I still cant decide if the GCO 2 has some features eliminated, being Php2k lower than the GCO 2000).

Also, upon checking the prices of steel, there seems to be a big disparity if I use a 2x8 C-channel stringer (2pcs 2x4) as opposed to fabricating angle bars as the stringer.

C-channel: 1 5/8 x 4 x 5/16 (20ft) - Php 2,300 (no other thickness offered in this size)
Angle Bar: 1 1/2 x 1 1/2 x 3/16 (20ft) - Php 675

So, for a 10ft stringer (1 side), it will be 1pc c-channel vs 1pc angle bar + probably 10 ft for the cross member, so it will still come out to around 1,000 PHP. Of course it wouldnt be as strong as the c-channel option but if its still strong enough for our use, then it would be nice to save some money.

The design looks like this:

What do you think?

Re: Outdoor Stairs

Hey bro koykoy,

What ever your decisions will be, then go for it but just make sure it is well protected from rusting since it gonna be located outside. If you think using angle bars will save you some money, be sure to keep it well supported, meaning complete with braces.

GO GO GO and GOOD LUCK !!! 😉

Re: Outdoor Stairs

Thanks Rosy for the encouragement, finally started this project during the long holiday. Just to document this:

This is only a 4feet high outdoor stair to access the roofdeck, right side will be attached to the wall, with 2feet wide steps and standard 7-11 inch riser-tread. I will be using 2x6 channel bar stringers (5/16 thick) and 3mm checkered plates. Also ordered angle bars (1-1/2 x 1/4 thickness) to support the steps, while at the same time function as nosing. The design might be a bit big for the requirement but since this will be an install and forget project, big is the key. Also, I have superactive dogs that are going to wreak havoc to lanky structures. Further, since the roofdeck is used for partying and getting drunk, a flexy stair might be dangerous for my 300lb drunk cousins and guests.

So, to start:

-Used excel as my drawing board to scale the exact dimension and length needed for the stringer as well as how the project will look. 🙂

-The few yet very heavy materials:
2x6 channel bars for the stringer
2-1/2 round tube (sched 40) for the support column
1-1/2 x 5mm angle bars for the step support/nosing
3mm checkered plate

-Good justification to buy some tools. haha. Bosch is at 20% off (orig price is 7,800) while Powercraft auto darkening helmet is at 10%(4,050).

Re: Outdoor Stairs

-Started cutting and thought this was as easy as using the compound miter saw. I was so wrong. Took around half a day to cut the 160-lb channel bar without any help.

-When I woke up the next day, somebody tried to shoot his urine to the prepped hole for the bolt. I love my dogs! hahaha

-Finally, I get to use the welding mask! The first weld. I have no idea if this is good enough.

Tried lugging the stringers to the site but they were too heavy for a one man job. So I decided to postpone the installation when people are coming to help (probably in 3 weeks time when the schedule waterproofing will start)

Got also a new 8-100C angle grinder (still at 20% off) and cut the 3mm checkered plate lengthwise in half for easier storage. (A 4' x 8' 3mm plate is about 55kg, damn these things are sooo heavy) Used about 3 cutting disc for the 8 foot job.
Tatara - 1.6mm (Php 28 ) - lasted about 4.5 feet
BDX - 1.6mm (Php 32) - lasted only 1.5 feet grrrrr!
Bosch - 1.0mm (Php 44) - cut the rest but also consumed half of the disc
***Note: will be using Tatara more in the future.

Happy new year everyone.

Re: Outdoor Stairs

Hey bro koykoy,

[COLOR="Red"]]First of all, can you please reduce the size of your pics to 640 X 480 so they can simply be contained just inside the PHM white space for easy viewing. Thanks.

Now regarding your project, you are doing great with your tool purchases and the metal stocks you are using. And with regards to your welding applications, can you grind therm down flat to expose the metal and see if there is/are any un-welded joints as I see in your weld applications, you did it sort of one by one weld applications. With the thickness of the C Channel, I think you won't have any problem applying continuous welds in a slow circular motion on the surface.

See if you can do another round of weld application on that area of joint just to make sure of a total fusion of the metal , remember, that is the main stringer carrying all those steps of angle bars plus the checkered plates, so just have to make sure all joints of the C Channels are sound and properly welded.

Anyway, CHEERS and again GOOD LUCK on the project. 😉 😀

Re: Outdoor Stairs

Been follwing this thread, Koykoy, and I admire your courage and skill!

I, too, am a woodworker and, occasionally, get into some metalwork. Your welds seem to be much much better than mine. Keep going!

Re: Outdoor Stairs

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Re: Outdoor Stairs

@rosy, thanks for pointing the pic size. theyre already corrected. as to the weld, i cant seem to do a continuous pass, i feel like i'll lose the arc. ok will do the grinding and do a second continuous pass this weekend.

@balarila, thanks bro. at one point, i thought i could have just used yakal. it would have been easier. but then, i also need to change the lumber trellises to metal due to rotting & weathering so i guess, we have to learn to do metal at times. 🙂